Comments on: “iPhone developers are stupid!”

By: frank

frank — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 13:57:10 +0000

interesting followup on quirksmode; "native iphone apps vs. webapps".

By: frank

frank — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 11:56:44 +0000

thanks for your feedback lode!

it is indeed weird that Google did not yet implement appcache and webdb for mobile reader. judging by the less-then-optimal gears-implementation of the desktop-browser version of reader, the reader-team does not seem to have ‘offline’ high on their list of priorities.

but an example that is very relevant when looking at mobile webapps is gmail for iphone&android, which indeed stores assets (js, css, …) locally and which keeps your mails in a local database. a truly great mobile webapp which i prefer over the native gmail-app on my android-driven htc hero.

concerning scrolling; i don’t have a problem on m.deredactie.be, but maybe that’s because i’m using a better handset? the same remark for the need to start your browser; on a multi-tasking phone one does not close the browser, so startup-times do not apply but more seriously; these kinds of quirks are bound to disappear rather sooner then later, no?

i think one of the most important advantages of web-based applications is the independence from both archaic gatekeeping methods by appstore-owners and -even more importantly- from platforms (which off course isn’t absolute, due to differences in what browsers support).

on the desktop the last few years have shown a clear movement away from native apps to webapps and there are no reasons why this could not happen on smartphones. and while it’s true that future might not be there yet, 2010 could well be a defining turning point, thanks to html5 offline capabilities, the android momentum and growing discontentment with gated application communities? so maybe the time is now anyhow?

By: frank

frank — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 11:30:19 +0000

cfr. the discussion on your blog (after you replied here); i was quoting PPK

i do agree that modern smartphone hardware offers a lot of functionality, part of which can’t be exploited in a web-only context. ppk mentions games as an example of apps that need to be close to hardware, but one can easily imagine others as well.

on the other hand (and i’ll quote myself from what i wrote on your blog);

if your app doesn’t force you to go native, it boils down to a choice between developing in/ for a golden cage (the iphone development environment and appstore) or radically choosing for freedom and openness. I know what i would do

By: Philip Paeps

Philip Paeps — Mon, 23 Nov 2009 19:27:02 +0000

The people you are calling “stupid” in this post are able to see beyond the “pocket webbrowser” you see in the iPhone and see the very portable battery-powered computer with many inputs, outputs and radios that is really there. “Web applications” don’t even begin to scratch the surface of what it could be used for if these people were allowed to apply their art unrestricted by Apple’s artificial limitations.

By: Lode Nachtergaele

Lode Nachtergaele — Mon, 23 Nov 2009 15:52:54 +0000

The future of mobile apps are indeed web apps. Good mobile apps have three things in common: they are fast, fast and fast. But.
1) Starting up Google Reader on Iphone requires a download of 300KB of Closure Javascript, CSS and so on. Caching in HTML5 may solve this but currently Mobile Safari does not help a lot becasue of the memory constraints on Iphone. Remember, downloading a 17KB minified jquery library requires about 300ms on a broadband connection and takes easily a second on a Belgian GSM network.
2) Scrolling trough a long list on Mobile Safari is much slower then when doing this in a (good) native app (Contacts for example). Hence building a snappy mobile webapp with a lot of data is very difficult (scroll trough the main page of m.deredactie.be and you know what i mean)
3) Before your mobile webapp starts, the mobile browser must be started. At least, it is on Iphone. I don’t know on Android or other mobile os in the market.
4) Every time the ad on m.standaard.be renders before the image I have the impression something is wrong.

All this currently brings the native app in a pole position for the best user experience on mobile. I’m waiting for the first webapp that starts faster and feels as zippy as the best native apps. And a webapp that generates money without resorting to mobile ads. Because that’s what at stake.

To conclude: mobile web is the future but is not there yet.